The Shotclock Pod: Pistons Shooting Woes, Knicks Rise, and Trade Rumors Heating Up

[00:00:00] Jose: All right, it's time to talk basketball. I'm Jose Salviati, Editor at thePeachBasket.net. He is Steve Purciello, a longtime educator, vice principal, high school basketball coach, athletic director, and the host of Celtic Chalk Talk. Celtic Chalk talk is a pod dedicated to the latest news and opinions surrounding the Boston Celtics from a lifelong fan, Steve. That pod will drop new episodes every Monday, but this is the Shop clock pod, the best 24 minutes of random random NBA thoughts online anywhere. This podcast was born out of the content of Steve's searching rules, random NBA thoughts articles, which he publishes weekly. Steve and I have exactly 24 minutes to discuss what's on his mind around the NBA today. We'll discuss his latest 13 rules, random NBA Thoughts article where he shares his random thoughts after week nine. Of the 20 25 26 NBA season, which includes an NBA Cup champion. Let's talk about it. Steve, are you ready? Ready. Let's go. Clock [00:01:00] is running. Alright, before we get to the NBA Cup champions, let's start with Detroit basketball. Now you call out something interesting. The Pistons have a towel. What is it and why does it not bode well for Detroit? I. Steve: If you're gonna, of all the pistons play a different brand of basketball basically and I say it in a positive way, they muck up the game. Defend, they're physical, they're big, they just throw a team out of their rhythm by the things they do. And they have some great defenders, Thompson enduring and so on and they do that. Takes a team out and takes them away from what they wanna do. But by the same token, the Pistons shoot 34.7% from three. Now I just did a little looking and the teams the last three years that won titles, and I'm not saying the Pistons can beat Oklahoma, but the teams that won titles [00:02:00] all shot 38% or better. Jose: Yeah. Steve: From three, you have to have somebody that can shoot from three. Now here's the interesting thing, Malik, be Beasley who's got all kinds of problems. shot over 41% last year for him, and they would've signed him if they did sign him. All of a sudden, Detroit now has a threat. They might need to. But they have a threat from three, a consistent threat that Jose: Yeah. Steve: other teams and makes them guard. I watched a couple games with the Pistons literally when Thompson had the ball. were almost daring him to take the three, and he's not a great shooter in any way, A good, real good player. what you are realizing there, Cade Cunningham, of course, can shoot a three. He could shoot anything, but a lot of those guys can't. And that's the biggest thing. So you are relying on the pistons. If they're gonna win, they've gotta muck it up, take you outta [00:03:00] your game. And just hang in there with twos and that's not an easy thing to do. So against a good team. So that I think is a major problem for the pistons. And I would think in the next couple weeks, and I talked a lot about trades, they're gonna be looking to grab a shooter or two. In the trades and they have a lot of decent players. They got, they're pretty deep, so they could probably pull something off to get a shooter or two in there, but everybody in the NBA is looking for a good shooter. It won't be as easy as you think. Jose: Before the show started we chatted a little bit about one of the differences between teams, I won't say good teams, bad teams, just between teams, and you said, there's certain teams that go out and find people. Fits. Find people that they need. You were just talking about the pistons need shooters. They're looking for shooters. Then there's other teams that just go and find the best player. Tell us a little bit about that distinction, and what that says about the pistons. Steve: Did you ever read Pat Riley's [00:04:00] book? Years ago? He wrote a book about the process, The book he talked about the team that's on the rise. They're getting better. Those teams fit pieces. In other words, they look at it and say, okay, we need a defender against the dribble drive. And they will go out and find that guy and put the pieces together Now, and I'm gonna use the Milwaukee Bucks as the Converse, Milwaukee Bucks or a team, they're on the downside. They're doing everything they can by their fingernails to try to keep you honest there. What do they have to do? They're just taking anybody who's talented and putting them out there. There's no thought on how to defend or we This or this. They're just getting bodies that are pretty good players and hoping Miles Turner hoping that will mesh together because if not, they're gonna lose [00:05:00] Giannis, but also. They're on the backslide, they're on the bottom, the back, Jose: Yeah. Steve: as they might say. So there's a big difference when a team's getting better. The Pistons had the pieces have peace with Malik, be Beasley, they still need one. And what the Pistons did was they've amassed, there's 10, 11 guys they can use every night. So now they've gotta start thinking, okay, we need this. We can get rid of this to get that. That's where they are. So you see the difference when a team's going up and when a team's going down. Jose: Right. Steve: that's what I'm like I'm thinking about. Jose: Yeah. Super interesting is something that, new fans of the game not, might not understand. That's the value of experience. Having seen it all, having read a lot, it is telling pistons are on their way up. Steve: it's a nice way to say somebody's old, but go ahead. Jose: You said it, not me. Let's keep going. We'll talk about the New York Knicks, the NBA Cup champions. Congratulations to New York. What does lifting the NBA [00:06:00] cup mean to New York and the next chances of lifting the LOB at season's end. Steve: I, I, I wanna applaud the Knicks for not putting a banner up. It's a silly tournament, and who cares, but. applaud them also for winning the Jose: Yeah. Steve: I think we would all would've loved to see them play Oklahoma, but didn't happen because San Antonio, won the game. Jose: Yep. Steve: now suddenly it's clear they're the most talented team in the East. The pressure on 'em. They're the best team in the east now, I'm not saying by a lot, but they're the best team in the east and now they've gotta fulfill it in the playoffs. We all know that's not an easy easy thing. And there's gonna be there's gonna be some good competition in the east because there's a lot of teams close together. I do think the Knicks are better than most of the teams. I think Detroit's the second best, and that's a shaky second best because for the reasons we talked about before, but there's a lot of teams that are coming on that can play with them if certain things happen. Jose: So you think the Nicks are better [00:07:00] than the pistons? We just talked about the pistons. You've got them above the pistons right now. Steve: I Jose: Okay. Steve: but if they met, the whole series comes down to this, do the pistons, muck it up. They tried to do last year in that series. By mucking up, physical, Jose: Sure. Steve: depends on what the referees allow and are able to get away with that type play. They and it becomes a half court game every time down. It negates some of the Knicks talent. And that's something, that, that's pretty important. And by the way, being physical against the Knicks means a guy like Brunson takes a beating. Jose: Yeah. Steve: wear him down. It's gotta wear him down. And by a beating, I'm not saying somebody punches him, but every play he's got, it's physical Jose: yeah. Steve: He's getting little nicks and shots and that's what, that's the difference between, they're not gonna play a running and gunning game against Detroit. So there's a difference. Jose: Yeah. Yeah. Make 'em work. [00:08:00] And that's what the pistons do. They make the other team work. All right. Let's let's play a little game here over the course of the next two topics. A game of, would you, right? You're a gm, you've got a, an n, b, A team. Would you trade for Anthony Davis, who apparently is on the block? What do you think? Steve: I wouldn't I, first of all, his contract's up after next year, and he's gonna want ridiculous money. Jose: Sure. Steve: a good team, if you're a good team, you have a player or two that's making good money. So now you're gonna go way into the probably towards the second apron. That's not good. But the bigger thing is how many games is he gonna play? Jose: Yeah. Steve: he's played 12 outta 28 so far this year. That's over 50%. He is missed. It's only gonna get worse. He's getting older. So it's a gamble. It's a big gamble. And I know this, if I'm a general manager, I'm thinking this. If I take that gamble, pretty obvious, a big gamble, and it doesn't work. I was a [00:09:00] general manager, so Jose: yeah. Steve: I'm not doing it. I don't know if there's many people out there that would take the shot and and do it. I think there's some that, know they're on their last legs. Team like Milwaukee, if they had the assets would gladly take him. The, again, the team on the downside, would Jose: Yeah. Steve: him? Would you trade for him? Jose: Yeah, that you, when I asked the question, I thought it through myself too. I think for me the answer is, it depends, right? I don't think I do it. I do it one of two reasons. One of two situations where I am one Anthony Davis away from actually being a competitor. You just roll the dice on one year, then I would do it. A team, gosh, I can't even think of a team right now. That would be one Anthony Davis away, but Anthony Davis. You're not gonna get 'em for, to your point for 50% of the regular season. But you get a healthy ad in the playoffs. And again, that's the risk, that's the gamble, that's what you're betting on. That changes the team's dynamic undeniably. And if you are one ad [00:10:00] away from having a shot against OKC, you take it the other. Team that I think would do it is a team that just needs a draw. You just, I just need somebody, 'cause people aren't coming to see my games. It's now I got Anthony Davis come and watch our games. But short of that, I, I agree. It's too risky. Steve: People aren't gonna pay to go watch him in street clothes Jose: It's a good point. Steve: It just, again, you wonder, you saw him come into the preseason way outta shape. kinda wonder if he really wants to play anymore. He, the money's great and that's, that's good. And he'll continue to be on a team 'cause he's Jose: Sure. Steve: money. However, you really wonder if that he's won a championship. So I don't know if he's got that thirst Jose: yeah. I. Steve: and be the best guy on the court anymore and keep himself in shape so he's healthy. Jose: Yeah. Steve: that would be the best way to answer that. Jose: Yep. All right, let's keep playing the game. Would you're a gm. Someone calls you up and says, are you [00:11:00] interested in John Morant? What do you say? Steve: No, not Jose: Really? Wow. Okay. Steve: yeah. First of all, he doesn't play enough. Second of all, look at the record of Memphis with and without him this year. Jose: Yeah. Steve: Third, I think he causes more problems than he solves at this point in his career. He Jose: Yeah, Steve: earlier. then if you look at the graphs, they talk about that he shoots more outside shots than he does go into the basket. Like he used to. He used to go to the basket a lot more. And why? Because he's, his body just can't, he's getting Jose: sure. Steve: over the years. Jose: Yeah. Steve: a lot of factors in this. Jose: I. Steve: I don't know if any of them say Yeah, so I don't think, I think some team that's not very good might take a chance with him. Like you were talking about Davis try to put people in the seats, but I don't think a team that's serious would want him. Jose: What a tough situation for somebody who, honestly was bordering on being the face of the league not too [00:12:00] long ago, and all of a sudden you were talking about him not even being tradable. He's still only 26 years old. He's still averaging 17 points a game. But most telling, and you wrote this in your article, the grizzlies are five and nine when he plays. Eight and five. Without 'em, they're better without 'em. That, that, that's staggering to me. Now the only thing I could say it in his defense for lack of a better way of putting it, his Dion Fox was not necessarily a winner in, in, in in Sacramento. Those are bad teams and he did his thing. But he gets to San Antonio, good team, maybe the right team for him, and all of a sudden he's playing great basketball and that team is winning. There is a good team out there for John Marette isn't there? Where he could really excel and be great. Steve: there's an interesting thought and you just touched on it. The Aaron Fox in, Sacramento has looked to be the best guy on the team. He's not. He's a number two or number three guy. He goes to San Antonio, he's not the [00:13:00] best guy, so the expectations aren't as high. Jose: right. Steve: And that's why, if you're putting a team together, number one guy's gotta be a top 10 player if you're gonna win. Jose: Sure. Steve: You can't put a guy and ask him to take unless he's got that potential to fill it. And the fox doesn't. The fox is a good player, but he's not. And you need talent. And he's a number two guy. You Jose: it. Steve: it, he's not a number one player. Jose: Yep. Yep. And that, that can be tough for a player to accept. It looks like Darren Fox has accepted that maybe John Morant finds his right team. But like you said, I think right now Steve: his game, I don't think his game is able to, because De Fox is a, has a little bit of a clutch pedigree, Jose: yeah. Steve: He also can shoot the ball. John Morant doesn't make his living shooting threes. Jose: Yeah. Steve: so I don't know [00:14:00] but like I said to you, some team, the Nets, I'm just using that Nets, he's gonna bring people out while the rest of the guys develop over the next couple years. 'cause Draft Jose: Yeah. Yeah. Steve: or young team. Jose: I Steve: and I'm using the Nets, a bad team Jose: I gotcha. Steve: him. And what he becomes is a sides show. And that's a shame because he was a great Jose: Yeah. That's wild. Yeah, that's, unfortunately, true. I think for AD and Jamant, there might be stop gaps, right? Where the team is just not good enough. But, we wanna keep staying somewhat competitive, get people in while we, get to our next phase Steve: Would you Jose: while we develop. Steve: Would you take Your team? Jose: I, yeah, that's a. I would rather have somebody like Anthony Davis at 50% of the regular season than John Mart. And you nailed it, right? Darren Fox, I think he, he won a couple of Clutch Player awards, most points in the fourth quarter. He has that clutch of gene. John Morant's claim to fame was just the wow factor, right? He did things that were incredible and you're not gonna do incredible things for long 'cause your body can't handle [00:15:00] that. Yeah, no I think that the John Morran era is over. He's peaked, let's put it that way. Unfortunately. I think he's, let's talk about somebody who's just starting out and I think it's so interesting. I think this kid, and I'm talking about Derrick Queen came into the league with just so much through no fault at his own pressure because of the decision made to, to acquire him for the New Orleans Pelicans. But it looks like maybe Joe Dumar was right about the kid. What? Are you seeing him? Steve: What's, first of all interesting is New Orleans is now won four straight. They won last night. Jose: Yep. Steve: and what they did and really interesting I'll talk about Queen in a second. Zion is coming off the bench, that, that is really an interesting thing to do. Queen is the center. I believe he's over 17 points a game and over 8.8 rebounds a game over the last four or five games. Jose: Yep. Steve: what he's doing, [00:16:00] he's and you know what, he's a rookie things, at some point it'll, he'll get better. So he will be. A real good player and New Orleans, James Borrego is doing a great job with what he's got and I was watching a game and the crowd is into it. This is a six and 22 team, or seven and 22. And the crowd, everybody, like there's an enthusiasm now and Zion. Accepts being off the bench, which is really, Jose: all right. Steve: So they seem to have turned it around. Queen has done it and you know what it's really interesting 'cause that draft pick, if they can, they still have, I think the worst record in the West. But if they can continue to move on. It will take the embarrassment away from Joe Dumars because it won't be a top three pick if they continue to play well. Jose: Yeah. Yeah. Steve: the patsy they were, and that's an important piece. Jose: Absolutely, man. What all you want as a fan is you wanna see some progress right in your team, and it looks like that's progressing. Good [00:17:00] to see you and I a couple years. Oh, go ahead. Go ahead. Steve: thing. No. I just wanted to add something du more is not du mores, but the front office. Nailed it. When they took Queen and Jeremiah Fierce, who's a point guard, who's a good player. So that's part of what they've done to get this, moving forward. I'm sorry, go ahead. Jose: Oh no. I was just gonna say, a couple years ago you and I used to do a really nice series during the off season about, players from the past and how they link to players in the future or p players in the present. We can't see the future, but is Derrick Queen, the new Moses Malone? Same high place center under, short center. Is he? Moses Malone. Steve: Now, let's slow down here. Let's slow down on that. You're talking about a guy who's probably top five, top seven, all time center. Jose: Un undeniably. Steve: so you are putting Derrick Queen in that. Jose: I'm asking, I'm just asking the question, man. Oh, that's all I'm doing. Is that his ceiling? Steve: I think he can be a good player. How's that as an [00:18:00] answer? But to say, he's gonna be that good. Slow down. Moses if you remember single-handed, not single, he had a good team around him, but Jose: Four. Four. Four. Yep. Steve: So he, he's, he wasn't bad. He wasn't Jose: No. Steve: day. Jose: He was fun to watch. He's just a grinder. I enjoyed watching him play. And yeah, if Derrick Queen can be half of that player, I think kudos to Queen. Let's see how it plays out. It's always fun to watch the start of someone's career. Let's start about a team that's at the end of their career though, and that's the Golden State Warriors. Can the old Warriors make an impact? You said some positive things. You said that it seemed like the Warriors, if they stay healthy, are close to turning it around. What do you see that gives you that optimism? Steve: think last night they won at the close game, which was important. I looked at the point differential and I put some value in that and they were plus 1.1 I believe that was. A situation where that value probably would've put them about seventh or eighth, and they're further [00:19:00] down the road in the Western Conference. being they're losing tough games. You've got some talented, experienced players, they're gonna figure that out if they stay healthy. I'm not gonna sit here and say they're gonna win the title. They're not. But what I'm going to say is if they, just. Start playing and win those close games. What you're gonna see is when the playoffs come around, nobody wants to play 'em. they're dangerous. They're dangerous. Any team with Jimmy Butler, any team, even though they're older, Curry's still, bringing it every night. Jose: Yep. Steve: but, and Draymond and they've got some other players, pki they're, they're gonna be trouble. So they, if they can figure things out, they'll be okay. They also have an asset that they wanna trade is Minga. And if they can get another decent player, and don't forget, he's making 20 something. If you start looking at salaries and they get another guy of 20 [00:20:00] something million, you're all of a sudden you got something here if that player can fit in with the group. So I think, let's not say it's over yet. Jose: Yeah. It's always interesting this time of year we start talking about, this is a team you don't wanna face in the playoffs. And I can't think of a team that fits that more than the Warriors. This is a championship team, a championship caliber team. If they're healthy, come playoff time. Yeah. You, anything can happen. You don't want to face 'em. But you also mentioned minga. And which is a great segue to our final topic. This is always this time of year when we start talking about trades, trade seasons coming, you threw out so many big names. Anthony Davis, clay Thompson, Jonathan Minga, Giannis, Trey, John Morant, LA Ball, and Lori Marketing and others. What do you think this season's gonna turn out to be? Because oftentimes we hear a bunch of talk and nothing happens, and then sometimes nothing. There's nothing going on and the big shoe drops. So who do you think is most likely [00:21:00] outta those names mentioned and the names you wrote about, that's gonna move Steve: I'll give an answer and then, I wanna hear what you think is the most valuable guy in that who you'd want. Jose: Nice. Steve: I think is will happen? I think it's all predicated on what Oklahoma City does over the next week or two or three. Jose: Wow. Steve: if Oklahoma City continues to, not continues, but stumbles a little bit, people think they got a shot. think Jose: Yeah, Steve: a couple weeks ago people said, oh geez, it's over, but. That would, and I still think Oklahoma, nobody, I don't think anybody can beat them in four games in the Jose: sure. Steve: But that, I think is the determining point. And don't forget if you get a healthy Anthony Davis on a good team, suddenly you're real good. The key word was healthy or if you get Giannis, my goodness. But that's a whole different thing. Lemme ask you though, who would you want from some of the names I'm, if you were running a team, who would you. What you know as [00:22:00] your, Jose: Yeah. Steve: Player. Jose: It, it all starts with with Giannis. If that guy's available, I want him on my team. This guy's a winner. He's a scorer. He's a phenomenal player. He's a draw. It starts with Giannis. If I can bring that guy into my team, I'm gonna do it. And he is young. I like Lalo ball. I know that there's a downside there. So let's just say this way, Giannis is the cream of the crop. And then you go you drop a couple of levels. Lalo Ball would be on the list though. Lori Markin is somebody I like. This is a great player who I think would be. You talked about the pistons at the start of the show, and they need something. They don't need Lori Markin, but there are teams out there that could use somebody like Lori Markin. This guy's a great shooter. He's clutch. I just think he's a phenomenal player who's just been on let's call him under the radar teams. You get him in the right situation. He's a great piece that might fit. Be the final stop for some teams. So those are the names that, that kind of stick out to me. How'd I do? Steve: No [00:23:00] it's interesting and I've alluded to this in the last couple weeks, Jose: I. Steve: I think the league with these guys that are 30 years old. Don't know the stress on the body or whatever it is, but they're hurting, they're out. Giannis is another gamble 'cause he's been out a lot. Jose: Sure. Steve: My point being that the game has changed. It's for the young and Yeah, I understand. Giannis in the series could bring you home. I get it, but I, if I were running a team, which God I'm not, thank God. But the point being, I want young bodies that, that, that are disruptors that can play. Jose: Yeah. Steve: want old people. I, again, Giannis in a seven game series. I'll take him anytime Jose: Right. Steve: being. always that question, and when you get these guys here, I think the stupidest thing, and I said it back then, was Philadelphia signing Paul George all that money. And Jose: Yeah. Steve: mb that money as a matter, just off the top of my head, think about that. [00:24:00] It's diminishing returns. They're gonna play less and their numbers aren't gonna be as good. And you're gonna give them three or four more years. Or Paul George, that he plays every other game. He's really, the other night he was he was there, he got a big rebound at the end, but he wasn't. Paul George that we Jose: Yeah. Yeah. Steve: Like that's where I think the game is going. You don't need those older guys. I look at the Lakers, Marcus Smart. needed somebody that can defend Marcus Smart plays every other game. and I, nobody liked Marcus like I did but the point being Yeah, it's a great idea. And yeah. If you get him from five years ago, yeah. It's a great thing. But it just, Jose: Yeah. Steve: For me, I want to, I wanna build a team with younger, under 30 players. Jose: Yeah, Steve: wanna spend 60 million. For a 31-year-old or any, anybody in that. And again, let me just finish with this. If you were to get Giannis in a trade, [00:25:00] two things happen. You're giving up a lot. Are you Jose: sure. Steve: a contender? Jose: Yeah. Steve: his contract's almost up. So now you're gonna be giving him another 60 million for a couple more years, and you're gonna tell me he's gonna play 60 games a year? No. So that's my point. Jose: Yep. Steve: And I understand everybody trade everything to win a title. I got it. Jose: Yeah. Steve: that, does that kind of answer it? Jose: A hundred percent. Yeah. And it, it encapsulates the difficulty of being a gm, right? Because you make the wrong Chalkice. You're out, like you said, you, I'm a former gm, so there's a lot riding on it for the team, for the franchise, and for that GM's job. So we'll see. I can't argue with you. Steve: I wanna make one point, and I Jose: Yeah. Steve: you earlier, Boston last night was in a back to back. played Friday night and they beat the heat. Who were in a back to back last night, they played against Toronto. Toronto's a pretty good [00:26:00] team. Jose: Yeah. Steve: Brown was out. Wow. in the first. Within six minutes, and I think Joe Missoula's doing a great job, but the first six minutes, Joe Missoula took I believe four guys out put four different guys in. That means he's going to number nine on his bench and he put some other guys, he went about 11 deep west. I don't know the exact, but the point being in a back to back, what you find generally is teams run outta gas in the third or fourth quarter of the second game. Jose: Sure. Steve: did by using guys, he used Luca Garza for over 20 minutes last night. Luca Garza hadn't played in a month and he played well. But the point being that's the young legs that Jose: Yeah. Yep. Steve: not asking your. Over 30 star to go out back to back and give you 35 minutes or 40 minutes for two nights in a Jose: Yep. Steve: And that's my point with Jose: Yeah. Steve: And I think Missoula [00:27:00] stumbled on something in the future in back to backs. And if teams have the depth, they will all do that because that would be the, the way to, Jose: Yeah. Steve: negate playing it back to back. Jose: Yep. Undeniable. Every GM wants a good, young, talented player that's cheap, but those are just hard to come by. But that's the game. That's what you signed up for. Welcome to the NBA GM game. But that's it. You heard the buzzer go off. Our time is up. Thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. Please make sure to read Steve's entire 13 rules, random NBA Thoughts article. We'll link it wherever you are watching or listening to this show. And of course, please subscribe, follow, comment. All that stuff means the world to us and we appreciate all of it. Thank you. Thank you. Join us again next week and have a great Christmas. Have a great holiday which is coming up in just a couple days. But again, do join us next week for more NBA random thoughts as we recap week 10. We'll talk then. Thanks Steve. I.